tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2257022282747854387.post970067362960096885..comments2023-11-22T22:04:17.326-08:00Comments on Get Whatcom Planning: More on Agenda 21: Talking to "Steve"Jean Melioushttp://www.blogger.com/profile/15759730663769578269noreply@blogger.comBlogger10125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2257022282747854387.post-68028095575869853812012-10-24T20:54:26.221-07:002012-10-24T20:54:26.221-07:00Hey Greg,
Bart's gotcha covered...
http://w...Hey Greg, <br /><br />Bart's gotcha covered...<br /><br />http://www.urbandictionary.com/zoom.php?imageid=33846Larry Horowitzhttp://www.urbandictionary.com/zoom.php?imageid=33846noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2257022282747854387.post-28157006343739265392012-10-24T05:56:19.700-07:002012-10-24T05:56:19.700-07:00Typically, those who attempt to inform the public ...Typically, those who attempt to inform the public of attacks on their interests by economically and financially powerful individuals are countered with dismissive, ad hominem criticism; usually that they are "conspiracy theorists,"<br /><br />And next, in some bastardized version of the reductio ad absurdum, with jocularity and sarcasm, much is made of the preposterous notion so many stalwarts of the master class would actually have time for all these secret conclaves.<br /><br />In fact, as civil law recognizes, conspiracies do not require face to face planning. They needn't even entail communication. Where individuals acting separately but in concert damage someone you usually have a civil conspiracy.<br /><br />For all the rhetorical debasement of the word, the greatest conspiracies evolve where powerful forces acting separately achieve an end from which they all benefit at the public expense.<br /><br />Though the powerful often employ conspicuous means: syndicates, monopolies, cartels and the like; by far their most useful tool is government and its easily seduced representatives.<br /><br />OK. Please pass the tinfoil, Larry.<br /><br /> g.h.kirschhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10751067888415362776noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2257022282747854387.post-61843092837597067342012-10-21T11:26:51.036-07:002012-10-21T11:26:51.036-07:00Traditional rural lifestyles that require city res...Traditional rural lifestyles that require city residents to subsidize. Everything from<br />Schools to law enforcement to fire protection to transportation are subsidized by efficient urban services. Why "pop" conservatives like Jack continue to support these subsidies is beyond my understanding. Maybe that is part of the ALEC conspiracy agenda. David Stalheimhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10588880557546749656noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2257022282747854387.post-59582668956965780802012-10-20T15:48:59.571-07:002012-10-20T15:48:59.571-07:00Free Merriam Webster Dictionary, Conspiracy theory...Free Merriam Webster Dictionary, Conspiracy theory: "a theory that explains an event or set of circumstances as the result of a secret plot by usually powerful conspirators."<br /><br />There's not a lot that's secret about the failure to adopt impact fees in Whatcom County. <br /><br />Jack's claim that David and I are conspirators just made me laugh, because everything we do is out in the open and our only power base is the law. <br /><br />But let me change my statement to "conspiracy theories thrive in the absence of facts." I'm not interested in a definitional debate. Jean Melioushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15759730663769578269noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2257022282747854387.post-12317895171468017712012-10-20T14:42:57.278-07:002012-10-20T14:42:57.278-07:00Jean,
Are you actually saying that all 'cons...Jean, <br /><br />Are you actually saying that all 'conspiracy theories' are "based on false facts or no facts?" That no conspiracy theories (before proven) actually describe an actual conspiracy? <br /><br />I'm not sure I agree. Like Jack, I firmly believe people are conspiring all the time. Most of our conspiracies have little or no impact, but some conspiracies certainly do. If Greg Kirsch is reading, he knows I'm alluding in particular to the bankers' conspiracy that created the Federal Reserve (as described in enlightening detail in THE CREATURE FROM JEKYLL ISLAND).<br /><br />I don't know whether any facts support the Agenda 21 conspiracy theory or not; however, I wouldn't group all conspiracy theories together. Some are likely to be proven accurate given enough time.<br /><br />For example, I believe there is a conspiracy to allow local developers to continue to receive tax subsidies in the form of inadequate impact fees, and I suspect there are quite a few facts I can identify to support my 'theory'. Maybe I'm just crazy. <br /><br />Aluminum foil, anyone?Larry Horowitznoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2257022282747854387.post-45098789040018838612012-10-20T12:26:34.988-07:002012-10-20T12:26:34.988-07:00Sorry, that first sentence was intended to say &qu...Sorry, that first sentence was intended to say "Conspiracy theories". A slip twixt brain and fingers.Jean Melioushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15759730663769578269noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2257022282747854387.post-21243628609597811112012-10-20T12:24:28.826-07:002012-10-20T12:24:28.826-07:00Conspiracies are based on false facts or no facts....Conspiracies are based on false facts or no facts. There are no facts to prove that Agenda 21 "caused" comprehensive planning or the desire to make sure that our water stays clean,<br /><br />As for planning -- some of the oldest words about property rights were originally in Latin: "Sic utere tuo ut alienum laedes." Use your property in a way that doesn't harm others. I think that most people would agree with that idea, if the issue were prevented that way -- rather than as a big bad one world government trying to take over your rights. Jean Melioushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15759730663769578269noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2257022282747854387.post-15242274529501117152012-10-20T11:08:36.240-07:002012-10-20T11:08:36.240-07:00Jean,
Jean,
As I am sure you know, and probably...Jean, <br /><br />Jean, <br />As I am sure you know, and probably agree, we all engage in conspiracies. <br /><br />Those who rail against Agenda 21 or, from the other side, about associations of people like the Tea Party engage in their own conspiracies to bring about the demise of the evil they see in the other.<br /><br />Our nation was founded by conspirators. David and yourself, along with those who believe as you do "conspire" to change both urban and rural Whatcom County while I, and a few who think as I do "conspire" to frustrate your efforts to end what I/we consider to be traditional rural lifestyles in Whatcom County.<br /><br />But, in fact, there are broad approaches or, “conspiracies,” at work in our world today. The ideas the United States were founded on are no longer much favored today but we haven’t really figured out what “new” we are going to replace the “old” with.<br /><br />I don’t really know whether or not Agenda 21 as a discrete “conspiracy” exists or not but, certainly, the kind of collectivist approach to various issues the various ideas attributed to Agenda 21 does exist as one of the overarching working theories contending for the minds of women and men in the world today; “Ordinary men and women cannot be trusted to do the right thing so those of us who are the modern version of the old-fashioned aristocracy need to be in a position to temper the excesses of the people.” To the extent that people holding those views involve themselves in "planning" the views are integraged into planning effors and, eventually, into "law."<br /><br />I think that lost in the background of the often silly discussions over things like Agenda 21 is a much more important problem. In places like America we’ve discarded the old but, as yet, have not discovered common ground as to what the new should look like. That, in a world in which the three power bases represented by radical Muslim movements, the rudderless remnants of what was once called the “Free World,” and the new power bases represented by what is left of the old Soviet Union, China and their allies are contending for influence may lead to the ignition point for World War III. <br />Jack Petreehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06275936244782707075noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2257022282747854387.post-78494483688606097882012-10-19T20:07:24.128-07:002012-10-19T20:07:24.128-07:00Indeed.
I always wonder what would happen if the...Indeed. <br /><br />I always wonder what would happen if the private sector were informed that planning is evil. Perhaps we should let them know that individual action, free of "collectivist" planning activity, leads to the best of all possible worlds. <br /><br />As things stand, MBA programs are full of courses in strategic planning. Businesses -- in our very own community, I daresay -- believe that their bottom line will be improved if they plan ahead. <br /><br />The war against individual rights has even spread to the Harvard Business Review. Not often recognized as a bastion of socialism, HBR published an article stating that "The primary task of management is to get people to work together in a systematic way." (Oct. 2006, The Tools of Cooperation and Change, by Clayton M. Christensen, Matt Marx, and Howard H. Stevenson.)<br /><br />Note that the last name of one of the authors is "Marx." Yes, the same last name as Karl Marx. The fact that Marxists can promote "cooperation" through the Harvard Business Review shows that Agenda 21 has gone viral.<br /><br />Whoa, sorry! Got a little carried away there. You can't just pick words out of a longer article, out of context, to support whatever point you want to make.Jean Melioushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15759730663769578269noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2257022282747854387.post-52699972097834259472012-10-19T09:44:21.176-07:002012-10-19T09:44:21.176-07:00Man was given dominion over the earth, to care for...Man was given dominion over the earth, to care for it as if a garden.<br /><br />But without central planning. Or, I guess, any planning.<br /><br />If Man were meant to plan, he would have been given the largest comparable brain capacity in the animal kingdom. It would weigh, oh, about 3 pounds or so.Pat Henryhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06787799814630339641noreply@blogger.com